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cdeveza  
#1 Posted : Thursday, August 11, 2016 6:25:54 PM(UTC)
cdeveza

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I built my dual mono BIIIse based on the integration manual guideline, however, there are things I not sure if I did it right. At first I was listening to it just fine for quite sometime, but I seem to have problem with separation, it does not seem right. I do have some separation, but not very defined. So I was able to purchase a test files in dsf format. It has a bunch of test that includes "Left Channel, Only" and "Right Channel Only" and some phasing test. The phasing test was ok, but when it gets to just Left or Right, the sound on either the Left or Right seems to come from Dead Center. I tried this files on my computer via Foobar and it works, "Left" goes only to the left speaker and "Right" goes only to the right speaker, but thru my dual mono BIIIse, the "Left" goes to the center and the same with the "Right" test.

The Integration guide for dual mono does not indicate how the input should be connected, and the way I did it is that the "Mclk", "D1", "D2" and "Gnd" were connected to both DAC modules via a Y-Connector and of course all the things mentioned on the integration guide were done. Is this how it should be done????

Please Help!!!
Russ White  
#2 Posted : Sunday, August 14, 2016 6:58:46 PM(UTC)
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For DSD you must route only the left data to one DAC and the right data to the other.

The "mono" setting of the DAC only applies to PCM/SPDIF

You can use a OTTO-II to switch between PCM mode (D1 and D2 routed as normal LRCK and DATA). In short both D1 and D2 are data in DSD and they have to be fed the same data if you want mono.
cdeveza  
#3 Posted : Sunday, August 14, 2016 7:18:31 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Russ White Go to Quoted Post
For DSD you must route only the left data to one DAC and the right data to the other.

The "mono" setting of the DAC only applies to PCM/SPDIF

You can use a OTTO-II to switch between PCM mode (D1 and D2 routed as normal LRCK and DATA). In short both D1 and D2 are data in DSD and they have to be fed the same data if you want mono.



Thanks Russ for your reply. I am not sure I understand, would you mind making a little diagram on how to use the otto II to accomplish this? I do have an OTTO II and I know how to activate it, but I am a bit confused as what what you area describing. Please.

I have mixed signal coming from the Amanero, sometimes just PCM(I guess) and sometimes DSF files. So if I understand it correctly, for regular files, all 4 wires from the amanero goes to both DAC and if the signal is from a DSF files then D1 from the amanero goes to D1 and D2 on one DAC? and D2 from amanero goes to D1 and D2 of the other DAC?? am I correct?? if so, how am I to accomplish this using OTTO II??

Please clarify a little bit.

Alex Deveza
Russ White  
#4 Posted : Sunday, August 14, 2016 7:35:25 PM(UTC)
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Sure no problem :) Happy to help.

Check out this post:

http://www.twistedpearau...-configuration#post19574

BTW there is good reason the ES9018 works this way - DSD is already a "mono" signal - each data signal carries exactly one channel - in PCM and SPDIF it always carries two. So all the mono flag does is tell the DAC to only use one of those - but that can't apply to DSD.
cdeveza  
#5 Posted : Monday, August 15, 2016 1:14:59 AM(UTC)
cdeveza

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Originally Posted by: Russ White Go to Quoted Post
Sure no problem :) Happy to help.

Check out this post:

http://www.twistedpearau...-configuration#post19574

BTW there is good reason the ES9018 works this way - DSD is already a "mono" signal - each data signal carries exactly one channel - in PCM and SPDIF it always carries two. So all the mono flag does is tell the DAC to only use one of those - but that can't apply to DSD.


Thanks again, I looked at the sketch and read thru the replies, but I have to admit, I am still confused. I understand the DSD part, correct me if I am wrong, on your sketch, side 2, the DSD_R and DSD_L, are those connected to cronos D1 and D2? then routed to the DAC's? that is how I understood it, but what about the bottom part, side 1 of the OTTO? where are those 4 wires connected???

Alex
cdeveza  
#6 Posted : Monday, August 15, 2016 2:34:40 AM(UTC)
cdeveza

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Originally Posted by: Russ White Go to Quoted Post
Sure no problem :) Happy to help.

Check out this post:

http://www.twistedpearau...-configuration#post19574

BTW there is good reason the ES9018 works this way - DSD is already a "mono" signal - each data signal carries exactly one channel - in PCM and SPDIF it always carries two. So all the mono flag does is tell the DAC to only use one of those - but that can't apply to DSD.


Ok, Ok, Ok, I think I got it(I think). Just a suggestion, I am sure people have mentioned it. The different inputs for dual monos should have been mentioned in the integration guide. It mentioned the output connection, but not the input, specially this one. I feel that most people that do dual monos are audiophiles that plays different format, including DSD. Thanks your help Russ, at least you are here to help us out, thanks again.

Alex
cdeveza  
#7 Posted : Monday, August 15, 2016 4:44:19 AM(UTC)
cdeveza

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Ok, I got the Otto working, but then I may have damaged something here. I was playing DSD files and accidentally switch the Otto to play PCM, then all I got was very distorted noisy sound playing PCM files, when I switch back to DSD files, it plays fine with DSD files. At first, before I play PCM file, I stop playing the DSD, then switch the Otto, then start the PCM files and it works, but after I accidentally switch to PCM without stopping the DSD, now all I got is noise. What could be wrong now??? Please help!! Russ???
Russ White  
#8 Posted : Monday, August 15, 2016 12:01:57 PM(UTC)
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Likely you only need to switch back to PCM and possibly reset the DAC (power off and on) :) Also just be sure you wired things correctly. Remember the idea is that for PCM both DACs get D1 and D2 as usual - but for DSD one DAC only gets D1 (connected where both D1 and D2 would normally go) and the other D2.

Edited by user Monday, August 15, 2016 12:04:09 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

thanks 1 user thanked Russ White for this useful post.
cdeveza on 8/16/2016(UTC)
cdeveza  
#9 Posted : Monday, August 15, 2016 3:41:55 PM(UTC)
cdeveza

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Yes, thank you, I fully understand the idea now, and it was actually working before I actually switched the OTTO while music was playing. I thought the DAC was damage, but I wired one dac directly, making sure that all jumpers and switches were set to just one DAC(not dual mono), and it works, then I noticed that when I use the OTTO, only one channel was having a hard time locking, during PCM playing, but fine when DSD playing. I figured that one side of the OTTO was fine, which is the DSD side, but PCM side, one channel is bad. I ordered another OTTO. I will try using relays and see how that works, with the some wiring as yours. Your wiring is actually very nice, very elegant, simple and direct. I like the OTTO, but its very sensitive. It may have been damaged due to sudden spike, during the switching.

BTW, does the Amanero-Hermes-Cronos combo detect the incoming signal? PCM or DSD? if so, it can be used to switch the OTTO automatically.
Russ White  
#10 Posted : Monday, August 15, 2016 9:53:34 PM(UTC)
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Hermes and cronus don't process/decode signals at all - but I believe the Amanero can set an output flag if DSD is detected.
cdeveza  
#11 Posted : Monday, August 15, 2016 10:08:55 PM(UTC)
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Interesting, I will investigate a little further...thanks russ.
cdeveza  
#12 Posted : Tuesday, August 16, 2016 4:04:00 AM(UTC)
cdeveza

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Got the thing working, I reconfigure the wiring, but its the same thing, dont know what happen, but it works now. I got separation on DSD now and PCM works now. Just listening to it right now. Dual monos, are definitely different, I guess because of larger current, it has more control and dynamics, very, very nice. My next project is to tap the SACD from that cheap player Denon DVD-1920, I may need your help again Russ, when I get to it. I already have a Transporter. I dont have the CD player yet, its comming...But I want to thank for your help on this switching issue.
Russ White  
#13 Posted : Tuesday, August 16, 2016 11:59:51 AM(UTC)
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Excellent news! Very glad to help.
Mike Lyons  
#14 Posted : Saturday, December 19, 2020 2:38:39 AM(UTC)
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I was not sure where to post this question but here seems as good a place as any. I have a dual mono BIIISE Pro set up and I'm hoping to use an Amanero/Hermes/Cronus and/or BBB/Hermes/Cronus. Switching between PCM and DSD seems to be an issue. I can see the manual solution but would like to automate. I can see that Pin 7 on the Amanero can be used to switch an OTTO (with a level shifter). My question, can I set a similar pin on the BBB? I've been trawling through various treads for hours. (My BBB is a Revision C running Debian 10.6 with Botic, MPD and upmpdcli. I can see this divice on BubbleUPnP so I'm hoping I've set that up correctly.)

Secondly, my case is getting filled up with various components. I was going to have just an optical input but that was scrapped after reading more. I might be able to shoe horn all the bits in a need but I want to keep the connection to the DACs as short as possible. So I wondered if I could put the Amanero/Hermes/Cronus and BBB/Hermes/Cronus Plus OTTO(s) in one case and use Teleporters. If I do that could I splitthe CAT6 cable to feed two Teleporters. That way I could have a Teleporter sat right on to of each DAC. Any thoughts?

Edited by user Saturday, December 19, 2020 10:50:59 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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