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rkuimelis  
#1 Posted : Monday, December 20, 2010 11:41:55 PM(UTC)
rkuimelis

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I'm preparing for a Buffalo II build in a couple of months and I want to do it right.

I've skimmed the IVY III and Legato descriptions, but I can't really figure out which one is right for me and why.

Why would I go with one over the other?? Is one superior??

Thanks.
pelliott123  
#2 Posted : Tuesday, December 21, 2010 6:24:01 AM(UTC)
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I am one of the few that prefers the IVY but once you match gains its a very subtle difference.
This is very subjective and probably very system specific. You need to buy both and make a decision.
rkuimelis  
#3 Posted : Tuesday, December 21, 2010 11:22:35 PM(UTC)
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OK - interesting. I think I'll start with the Legato and go from there.

pelliott123  
#4 Posted : Wednesday, December 22, 2010 6:16:42 AM(UTC)
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The IVY is simpler to build and easier to power
I think the Lagato is a tedious build
solarstabi  
#5 Posted : Wednesday, December 22, 2010 6:51:01 AM(UTC)
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As stated by TPA in another thread, if driving headphones (balanced) directly of IVY or Legato, IVY is better choice.
Certainly works for me driving Sennheiser HD540s (600 ohm) & HD800s (300 ohm) either individually or together (B32, which has integral IVY).
IVY has more than enough grunt for this application. Also have single-ended line outs for amplifier (not on at same time as headphones in practice, but have done it to prove it works).
If using a separate headphone amp, consider Legato. If you want simple, go IVY. Quality is certainly up to the HD800s playing 24bit/96k or redbook (CD) music.
rkuimelis  
#6 Posted : Wednesday, December 22, 2010 3:17:23 PM(UTC)
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Thanks for the additional thoughts, guys. Please keep it coming if there's more to consider.

I don't plan to drive headphones directly, and I don't really mind a tedius build, so Legato still looks like a winner for me.

stephen1212b  
#7 Posted : Thursday, December 23, 2010 2:13:51 PM(UTC)
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The IVY provides better control of the bass with a sense of greater extension and drive. It also reveals everything there is good or bad in the high frequencies. Perhaps because of its use of negative feedback it is very revealing of power supply differences. You will want Tridents on the Buffalo 2 for certain, and the Placid is a better choice for powering the IVY. The Legato is warmer with a rounder bass. Full but not as extended and with a more toe tapping pace in contrast to the IVYs tight drive. The high frequencies are more relaxed and immediate, keeping a more coherent musical timing with the bass. There are definitely songs which I prefer to play on each of them. Electronic Synth based tracks and classical generally shines with the IVY while Female vocals and simple solo instruments are often more inviting with the Legato.

These comments refer to the original Legato. I will report on the Legato 2 when I have the time.
thomaspf  
#8 Posted : Thursday, December 23, 2010 4:20:46 PM(UTC)
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+ on the bass control. The IVY extends a lot lower so recordings that are mastered without a high pass subsonic filter can sound pretty wild.

The 24/96 edition of new the Elton John/Leon Russel album from HDtracks is a great example that highlights the differences.

Lower and more controlled bass can often translates into a better sense of space if you listen to recordings of real recording venues.

Cheers

Thomas

rkuimelis  
#9 Posted : Friday, December 24, 2010 4:27:10 PM(UTC)
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Based on the last two comments, I may go for the IVY instead of the Legato. I'd hate to give up extension and detail. The pendulum swings again. Definitely planning on the Tridents. As pelliott123 indicated, I just may need to try both!

Merry Christmas, everyone!
Russ White  
#10 Posted : Friday, December 24, 2010 8:24:25 PM(UTC)
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You may indeed want to try both, and fortunately neither are very costly.

I don't find the Legato lacking any detail or extension in any way. The Legato to me sounds very accurate and realistic, but not at all harsh. IVY to me has many of the same traits, but does sound a little more "up front". IVY-III really excels at driving headphones directly.

I have listened to both for so many hours I really can't count, and I am hard pressed to say I really prefer one or the other.

Cheers!
Russ
pelliott123  
#11 Posted : Saturday, December 25, 2010 5:54:21 PM(UTC)
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I agree with Russ, the legato is lacking NOTHING! I have both IVY and Lagato and with my System I am leaning toward the IVY. I may switch back at some point, that why I suggests to try them both. I listen to maggy IIIa's which allows you to hear the difference quite readily.
rkuimelis  
#12 Posted : Friday, January 14, 2011 9:59:27 PM(UTC)
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If I remember right the IvyIII has either 2 (default) or 4v (optional) output level.

Could not seem to readily locate the output level spec on the Legato. Anyone know it?
Russ White  
#13 Posted : Friday, January 14, 2011 10:10:10 PM(UTC)
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It is about 1.5V The reason is I did not want people to have to attenuate the signal much for normal listening, thus geting as much of the true signal as possible.
sphinxvc2  
#14 Posted : Friday, February 11, 2011 12:39:30 AM(UTC)
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I'd like to build a budget Buffalo II DAC. Since I already have a head-amp, can't I use the Buffalo II without one of these IVY or Legato output stages? I need RCA output from the Buffalo DAC to feed my amp, do I need one of these output stages to get RCA out? If it is possible, are there any drawbacks to not using an output stage?

LeonvB  
#15 Posted : Friday, February 11, 2011 11:38:42 AM(UTC)
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Quote:
If it is possible, are there any drawbacks to not using an output stage?

It is possible, but the amount of noise + distortion will rise significantly. It's much like building a V8 motor and using only 6 cilinders.
Russ White  
#16 Posted : Friday, February 11, 2011 12:13:07 PM(UTC)
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sphinxvc2 wrote:
I'd like to build a budget Buffalo II DAC. Since I already have a head-amp, can't I use the Buffalo II without one of these IVY or Legato output stages? I need RCA output from the Buffalo DAC to feed my amp, do I need one of these output stages to get RCA out? If it is possible, are there any drawbacks to not using an output stage?



You can, but there will be DC offset at the output, and it will not be filtered. So you would need to AC couple (with a cap) at a minimum. The performance will be good, just not as good as it can be.
glt  
#17 Posted : Saturday, February 12, 2011 11:38:32 AM(UTC)
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sphinxvc2 wrote:
I'd like to build a budget Buffalo II DAC. Since I already have a head-amp, can't I use the Buffalo II without one of these IVY or Legato output stages? I need RCA output from the Buffalo DAC to feed my amp, do I need one of these output stages to get RCA out? If it is possible, are there any drawbacks to not using an output stage?



If you can rewire your headphones to balanced, the IVY can be used as a balanced head amp straight out of the balanced outputs, in addition to putting the DAC in current mode, thus affording better snr and thd numbers. Thus you can get benefits at "both ends"
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